Takoon NOVA versus Cabrinha Crossbow

Beul
Gast
Juli 30, 2005, 19:58:00
edit2Rapporteer  
Over de vliegeigenschappen van beide kites is de laatste dagen al aardig wat geschreven...en in grote lijn kan ik mij vinden in het verhaal van EricV4 over de NOVA. Als de kite nog iets verder wordt getuned is de windrange zeker indrukwekkend. Maar even de beide kites vergelijken. Op kiteforum stond een artikel dat vermeldde dat de Cabrinha Crossbow een kopie is van de eerste modellen van de Takoon Nova, maar dat de NOVA inmiddels al een model of drie geloof ik verder is door ontwikkeld, en dat klopt naar mijn mening precies. Op de NOVA zit een one-pump system en de kite is mooier afgewerkt. De NOVA is tijdens het varen een stuk stabieler en reageert wat subtieler op het (de)poweren van de kite. Ik word in ieder geval een stuk gelukkiger van het varen met de NOVA dan met de Crossbow. Ik raad iedereen aan de kites uit te proberen want het is een hartsikke leuke ervaring en dit nieuwe type kite heeft zeer veel potentie. Morgen kunnen beide kites getest worden en de windvoorspellingen zijn top, dus ik zou zeggen, test die handel op de Brouwersdam!!

Succes
DaRipper

Berichten: 370
Antwoord #1 Juli 31, 2005, 00:49:33
edit2Rapporteer  
...................model of drie geloof...............

Waar baseer je dit op?
Landon
Gast
Antwoord #2 Juli 31, 2005, 10:54:04
edit2Rapporteer  
Als ik naar de berichtengeschiedenis van de persoon kijk die deze topic is gestart dan zie ik erg vaak de woorden "Brouwersdam", "Nova", "Natural High" langskomen. Vind het meer een eenzijdig promopraatje van iemand die de Takoon Nova wil aanprijzen. Hoorde via een dealer dat Cabrinha in Februari al bijna klaar was met de Crossbow maar dat deze kite toen nog niet high performance genoeg was om geintroduceerd te worden. Na drie maanden doorontwikkelen heeft men deze eigenschappen pas werkend gekregen terwijl je optisch geen verschil zag aan de kite.... Toen pas was het voor Cabrinha duidelijk om over te stappen op dit nieuwe concept en alle andere kites Classic te noemen. Als ik alle reviews van de Nova lees dan hebben ze waarschijnlijk wel het brede inzetbereik en de safety goed onder de knie, maar over high performance eigenschappen heb ik nog niet veel gelezen of gezien. Waarschijnlijk zijn ze pas op het punt waar Cabrinha in Februari was...De Crossbow schijnt echt vet hoog te vliegen en is super snel. Vandaag testen op de Brouwersdam en je niet gek laten maken door al die verkooppraat.....
Beul
Gast
Antwoord #3 Juli 31, 2005, 18:07:42
edit2Rapporteer  
Landon, het gaat om mijn mening, jij hoeft het er niet mee eens te zijn..volgens mij schrijf jij nagenoeg hetzelfde stuk maar dan positief over de Crossbow, jouw mening, prima. Dus kom niet met je verkooppraatjes verhaal, ik raad aan het einde zelfs aan beide kites te testen!!!!!

Dus niet zeiken op iemand als je zelf hetzelfde verhaal op hangt!
WIMPIII

Berichten: 766
Antwoord #4 Juli 31, 2005, 18:21:46
edit2Rapporteer  
Wij Nederlanders zullen toch niet zomaar in al die verhaaltjes trappen. Testen is inderdaad de beste optie. Cabrinha heeft ook een leuk value for money verhaaltje op de site. Klopt ook niet veel van. Zij gaan uit van een 2-kite-set tegen een 4-kite-set met als kleinste maat een 12. Ik ken niemand in NL met zo'n set 18,16,14,12. Ze lullen allemaal maar wat.
~Sjors RE-CO2

Berichten: 1376
Antwoord #5 Juli 31, 2005, 18:22:04
edit2Rapporteer  
De crossbow is high performance en de Switchblade wordt de intermediate variant....
In dat op zicht is het een Vegas met een Raven vergelijken als we het over de Nova en de crossbow hebben.
Alleen qua afwerking kan je dan een vergelijking maken... Prijsvergelijk is ook wel interessant.

Ben blij dat er geen one-pump op komt... En zeker ook dat dat recon eraf is... Al die tirelantijntjes... KAN ALLEEN MAAR KAPOT!

@ Vavoom "Dus niet zeiken op iemand als je zelf hetzelfde verhaal op hangt!"  Niet zo huilen.....

Sjors
posty

Berichten: 2454
Antwoord #6 Juli 31, 2005, 19:03:37
edit2Rapporteer  
tirelantijntjes genoeg op de crossbow met 6 katrollen!

ha ha, je kon er op wachten natuurlijk.
eerst hadden we de eeuwige tube vs foil discussie, naish vs de rest en nu nova vs crossbow.....
posty

Berichten: 2454
Antwoord #7 Juli 31, 2005, 19:27:35
edit2Rapporteer  
De crossbow is high performance en de Switchblade wordt de intermediate variant....
In dat op zicht is het een Vegas met een Raven vergelijken als we het over de Nova en de crossbow hebben.
Huge hang time due to the high projected area of the kite. (uit handleiding nova)
Beul
Gast
Antwoord #8 Juli 31, 2005, 20:23:21
edit2Rapporteer  

Sjors
Citaat

@ Vavoom "Dus niet zeiken op iemand als je zelf hetzelfde verhaal op hangt!" Niet zo huilen.....


huilen doe ik niet, ik geef gewoon een reactie op mijn bericht....en waarom geen one-pump is toch alleen handig, zeker wanneer het het zelfde systeem is als de slingshots en dat is het

KiteDemon

Berichten: 6806
Antwoord #9 Augustus 01, 2005, 18:14:40
edit2Rapporteer  
Geschreven door een Hollander, maar wel in het engels.


Disclaimer: No affiliation to any brand whatsoever. Have owned Naish, North, and have used the Cabrinha Blacktip 03 the last 2 years. Haven´t tried any 05/06 kites. I weigh 75kg, use a WT 142, been kiting since 2001, advanced intermediate (no unhooked stuff), prefer waveriding. Never owned Takoon but like the brand and sort of expected the Nova to be the better one...

Conditions: South West Holland, choppy waters, gusty on shore wind, according to a nearby post 10-12 m/s at the start, slowly lessening to 8-10 m/s. Calculate it to knots and it might seem high, but in reality these measuring posts always seem to give a higher indication: anything less than 8 m/s usually isn´t worth going out.. Didn´t try my own kites that day but saw others ripping with sizes 10-14.

The Nova: there was a 12 to demo, no other sizes. Build seems fine. It has a set of pulleys at the kite. Tried it the first, for 15 min with winds 10-12 m/s, and after testing the crossbow again for about 15 min with winds 8-10 m/s, power was great both of the times.
In the water it has a soft feel to the bar. The bar is loose because of the depower system: UDS like. You could feel that the kite can depower well, but in the gusts your arms just aren´t long enough. The velcro stopper is a laugh, the rep actually put some extra velcro around it to add resistance. He said the final kite (as on sale here by mid august) would feature a "pro package" with a working stopper and a cleat system to fix the bar at any level... sounds beter but for now I didn´t like the feel of the bar or the steering, and the depower ability that it has seems to be wasted with the current system. The depower strap is too far away to comfortably reach it. Trying to spin the bar by letting it go results in the bar flying 1,5 meters away and you lose all power. Relauch was excellent though, and it is by all means a very safe kite because of this feature. My first run I was just trying to get used to the way it turns and jumps, different! When I tried it again after using the X-bow I was more used to the feeling and got some decent air; not higher than usual but definately more hang time. Riding toe side and using the bar one handed is possible, although the depower line under the bar would slap my hand on occasions..

The Crossbow: There was a 12 and 9 on demo. Build seems fine. Lots of pulleys everywhere: 2 sets at the kite and a set at the steering lines on the bar. Bar looks very solid.
In the air it has more bar pressure than the Nova, but also a bit more feedback, more the feel of a classic kite. Adapting to it seemed easier. The depower works a lot better: the power is nearly gone at the stopper ball, and punching it out leads to complete depower. Relauch was not a problem, even on a few occasions when it folded inside out after a crashed loop. I thought with all the bridles I´d be f** but they didn´t tangle, and it turned back into the relaunch position. On another occasion it hot launched in the middle of the window, but pushing the bar away prevented me from being catapulted. A big pro is the fact that the stopper works for spinning the bar, it won´t punch out doing this but do it fast because you lose a lot of power anyway..
By this time I was getting a bit more used to the way the kite was behaving a could get some decent jumps. The extra hang seems to open possibilities for board offs and the like, but then there´s the problem that you need to hold the bar down firmly or you´ll come down fast. Because it turns fast during the jump this will take some time to adapt to. Same thing for toeside riding one handed, which is less easy to do than with the Nova. Maybe the powerlock will make things a little better in this section, but it will probably remain a drawback on these types of kites.

Speed: I mention this separately because it puzzles me. Both kites (the 12´s) were alike but very different from the C shaped kites. when cruising the kite turns as fast as a 14, and delivers quite some power from moving it about. Parking it and pulling the bar towards you works just as well, but can be a bit of a nuisance with your arms so close to your body.
It travels up quite fast for jumps, and will turn back quickly during the jump, a bit too quick IMO because doing one handed jumps trying to keep the bar sheeted in for power makes the kite travel too far during the landing. This will take more time getting used to I guess.
The big drawback however was turning it through the window. Both kites initiate a turn quickly, but then seem to turn slower and slower. I crashed the X-bow a couple of times into the water during a kite loop beacuse of this. After a while I sort of figured how to do it by having the bar midway, sending the kite up far enough and pulling hard, and the kite now looped very fast.. Still can´t really figure it out, but another point of adaption I guess. The Crossbow is a safer kite to loop anyhow because if you crash the power is a lot less by pushing the bar away from you.
The 9 Crossbow felt more like a 10 or 12 in speed of turning, and I all in all I found it a lot more manouvrable and enjoyable, great for looping as well, although initially because of me steering technique I crashed it a couple of times.

A 16 X-bow or 15 Nova (which I haven´t tested) might work but I´m afraid will be really slow so not that much fun to use.

waveriding: too bad there were no decent waves to ride. In Holland we have wind driven waves, so in moderate windspeeds I have to loop the kite in order to stay on the wave. Because of the slow turning of the 12 I´m not sure it´s suited to our conditions. On the other hand, in high wind speeds It´ll be great to turn of the power and ride the wave; I think the combination with a dedicated waveboard will be fantastic because you don´t need to edge as much when using the kite.

Conclusion:
pros:
A big step forward in terms of safety and depower. If you have gusty winds, unsafe launches and especially offshore wind wave conditions it is a must. I prefer the X-bow because it´s easier to adapt to, the depower is more efficient and the stopper ball works.

cons:
-If you kite flat water, have a safe launch and constant wind you´ll probably have more fun on you current setup than using time to adjust to the new way of riding: keeping the bar sheeted during jumps and troubles with one handed riding to name the most important.
- The X-bow has a lot of pulleys and I´d hate to think wat happens when a line should break from chafing with sand; if I buy it I´d like to feel safe using it for at least 2-3 years and I´m not sure that´ll be the case..
- I get the feeling that Takoon put the Nova on the market before sorting out the bar (stopper, cleat) because of the introduction of the X-bow, which is understandable marketing wise, but may backfire on them now that IMHO it is still a bit inferior to the X-bow
- Most of all I think the price isn´t justified: OK, a 2 kite setup will cover a large range, but why should this mean we pay for 3? The added safety might prevent you from losing your life in a sudden squall: Is it our responsability to pay more because of that (yes) or should the companies be more ethical and make this feature available to everyone, especially newcomers to the sport (again yes).

Happy I could test them back to back, thanks to the reps for that. I was excited reading about these kites on this forum, and the marketin hype surely led me to believe I needed them fast. I still think I´ll need one, maybe a 9 for high wind days combined with a waveboard for extra range and fun, but I´m not in a hurry anymore...

FD (giving you a lot to read for just 2 cts!)



posty

Berichten: 2454
Antwoord #10 Augustus 01, 2005, 18:34:15
edit2Rapporteer  
wauw, wat een review. de beste tot nu toe! klinkt allemaal erg logisch.
Wimt

Berichten: 2498
Antwoord #11 Augustus 01, 2005, 18:52:12
edit2Rapporteer  
Heb ze zien vliegen op Brouwersdam. Flysurfer speed 10 m met een duitser van 120 kg ging ze straal voorbij.
Low-end is ook niet wat, want toen de wind bijna ging liggen, kreeg ik de Crossbow even in handen, maar niet overtuigend.   
chaosteam-nl
Gast
Antwoord #12 Augustus 11, 2005, 11:01:48
edit2Rapporteer  
...................model of drie geloof...............

Waar baseer je dit op?


heel simpel.....
dhr Legaignoux was onwickelar bij takoon en is overgestapt naar cabrinah....
takoon heeft al 2 jaar geleeden die kite ontwickelt maar het recht op het patent ligt bij meneer Legaignoux....
darom was cabrinah sneller.....
sanappie ?????
KiteDemon

Berichten: 6806
Antwoord #13 Augustus 11, 2005, 11:14:17
edit2Rapporteer  
Nog een paar verschillen tussen Xbow en Nova op een rijtje.
De bar gaat ook erg bepalend worden bij dit soort conceptkites.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
davo wrote:
can't see why in the meantime a fixed loop couldn't be used, just ensure it has a release so the kite can still de-power--easy


It can be used, yes.

BUT, one of the major concerns, and in fact one of the important (maybe THE most important) reasons why Bruno developed this new kite concept, was "total safety".

Meaning - if you let go of the bar, the kite depowers totally.
Important, because if you get unconscious (hit by/on your board, on the beach, other obstackles) - your kite will depower fully, as you let go of the bar.
This is not possible if you had any kind of stopper ball or lock or fixed loop 
And this could often be fatal in such situations 

We have all seen over the years, that when you have to pull a safety device (of any kind) - accidents will happen, because it is often not possible, or it goes all way too fast, or you wont do it because you are "mentally blocked" in such a dangerous situation, no matter how often you have practiced doing it 

Other design issue: keep it simple !

4 lines only, and having bigger windrange, full safety (no releases), easy relaunch (can be done on land also - and should work on snow I assume...).

Thats why the Takoon Nova has a bar with direct rear lines.
You need a longer depower strap, but you obtain the low bar pressure which is necessary for being able to ride longer, and not get tennis elbows.
Also better for one handed kite control.

Downside is of course the longer stroke on the depower, so you have to adjust the strap much more, when wind changes.

One important thing that many do not know:
The rear line tension on the Nova/X-Bow is not like used to on older LEI kites - where you have no tension at all, when the kite is depowered (but still pulling a lot on the front lines).
The rear line pull is very linear - meaning, if you go out in 9m2 wind (with a 12m2 kite) - you have the Nova/X depowered a lot - but your rear lines are tight and have almost the same pull, as if you were out in 14m2 wind with the kite.

Thats the whole idea of this kite concept - that you can adjust power through a much greater wind range, without losing tension (bar pressure) on the rear lines, and keeping the steering/turning ability throughout the whole windrange.

X-Bow has a more direct feel, and shorter depower travel.
Nova has a much more usable bar pressure for your body (on the cost of longer travel  ), and easier one handed control.

The turning ratio in reality is in fact somewhat the same, as when you have less travel and more pressure - or more travel and less pressure - equals out when on the water (we all know this, from the "Airblast" days).

Just some facts (and experiences after having flown) about the Nova and Crossbow concept.

Some bar issues has to be developed I think - maybe different settings for different kitesurfers ?

Kindly, Peter Frank
chaosteam-nl
Gast
Antwoord #14 Augustus 11, 2005, 11:19:14
edit2Rapporteer  
Nog een paar verschillen tussen Xbow en Nova op een rijtje.
De bar gaat ook erg bepalend worden bij dit soort conceptkites.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 



die zijn bijna het zelfde system....
behalve dat je die microhook voor de depowerloop van het recon system  kunt overneemen....
KiteDemon

Berichten: 6806
Antwoord #15 Augustus 11, 2005, 11:27:20
edit2Rapporteer  
De barren lijken totaal niet op elkaar.
Vraag mij af wat er gebeurt als je de barretjes zou verwisselen.
~Sjors RE-CO2

Berichten: 1376
Antwoord #16 Augustus 11, 2005, 12:08:28
edit2Rapporteer  
Kan denk ik niet Fer, want de Nova heeft toch geen katrolletjes aan de kite???

Als dat wel zo is dan vaart die denk ik een stuk beter.... want met de crossbow bar zijn je lijnen altijd op spanning
KiteDemon

Berichten: 6806
Antwoord #17 Augustus 11, 2005, 12:27:44
edit2Rapporteer  
Elk voordeel heeft zijn nadeel.
De Nova heeft wel weer minder bardruk dan de CB, maar een allejeeses lange depowerweg.

Naish zal wel weer met de juiste oplossing komen......  (tong_kitesmiley)
 
bbbram
Gast
Antwoord #18 Augustus 11, 2005, 20:36:27
edit2Rapporteer  
kan je met de crossbow goed met een hand varen.
of moet je de bar alijd goed vasthouden.
KiteDemon

Berichten: 6806
Antwoord #19 Augustus 16, 2005, 18:45:05
edit2Rapporteer  
Nog een vergelijking tussen CB en Nova door een Northrider.
Het is maar een klein stukje tekst......



Well, what a weekend... had the opportunity to fly both the Nova and the Crossbow in some resonably varied conditions.

The Nova

Mr. Blueswan turned up with a couple of Novas on saturday. Was going to pinch JV's, but was having too much fun winding him up about me having first go, only for him to then get the kite later that day with its wrapper still on 


Blueswan was all up for watching the user guide DVD, being the big nancy that he is (RTFM? RTFM? I don't RTFM... I'm a bloke FFS) and then I set up the kite while he was getting changed.

The user guide says to top up the struts after you've inflated the kite, but I couldn't be bothered trying to do that with the thing wrapped around me, so I just pumped it up like a regular kite.

The bridles are actually very simple, but still took a little while to untangle them. It's pretty obvious whether you've got it right or not. I'm definitely a fan of simplicity, and am often cursing my 5th line, so it's a bit complicated for my liking, but it's really not too bad.

The bar is a little 'busy' for my liking. The two plastic-coated depower ropes sort of keep their coiled shape, and make it a pain to lay the bar out neatly, and I think there are too many trim options - I'd prefer a cleaner bar - but it's alright. I like the range of depower in the strap though, and it's easy to use.

Launching, I instantly fell in love with the user-friendliness of this kite. We were sailing at Hengistbury Head, which is a gusty launch spot, and the beach is litered with shells and sharp stones - any kind of drag from the kite invariably leads to cut & bruised feet. The instant depower is great - don't get dragged at all.

There was a massive shore-dump, and the wind was pretty onshore - very nasty conditions for getting out - but I immidiately felt comfortable to dive the kite aggresively, knowing that I could kill the power. I found a little difficult to maintain constant power delivery to get out over the waves, but you can really work the kite hard, and just sheet out if you get caught by a gust.

The kite doesn't move fast for a 12m. It turns fast, but it doesn't move fast through the window... probably because you don't need to edge hard to control the power, you just sheet out!

Trying to edge upwind is a little difficult, as the bar moves side to side slightly, and I found I needed to sheet in and out quite a lot to maintain a steady pull. It was hard to find a comfortable point, where the kite was set, and I could just sit back, dig in and edge upwind.

Throw a turn, and the value of the kite to an intermediate rider becomes apparent - you can be very very agressive with this kite, and not get spanked. You literally just crank the kite across the window, and carve through the turn, with power on tap the whole way through, but with no worry that if you loose your edge, you're going to pendulum under your kite.

This confidence-inspiring ride means that I was quickly trying agressive jumps - redirect the kite as hard & fast as I could. The kite certainly boosts, and has a very floaty hangtime and a soft redirect, but it's not a super high performance machine. One guy on the beach said that one of my jumps looked about a line length in height though - it did feel high, but not the breathtakingly high jumps I do on my 10m.

There were some reasonable waves forming later on, and I found it much easier to get the kite timing right than I would on my own kite, where I often find I get lift just at the critical moment where you want to carve the lip. With the Nova, you can be so damned agressive with the kite, you can throw the kite, and then concentrate on getting the timing of your carve right.

At the bar end, on the water, the steering and sheeting is very light. You get great feedback when a gust hits, although the difference that is made when you sheet in and out is much more vague than on my own kites. However, the steering seemed a bit too light - was hard to tell what the kite was doing.

Did a couple of backloop kiteloops - man, that is SO cheating! Sheet out enough, and it's like pulling them when you're seriously underpowered - none of that savage power surge that pulls you horizontal and gives you that "this is gonna hurt" scream in your head.

Windrange... the best indication is that some people were fully powered on 9m kites when I first went out, and then some were undepowered on 12m kites later on. The Nova was set on maximum depower, and it was at its limit at times in the gusts, so I'm sure it won't go lower than 9m, but the low end wasn't tested - 14m, probably, which is a pretty impressive range.

Packing up, had a closer look at the build quality. Not amazed, I have to say. The dacron/nylon on the struts looks and feels a bit flimsey, and generally, it looks like a typical Takoon 'light' build, rather than feeling like a hard-wearing kite. The bloody strut deflators don't work very well either - you can push the North ones in, so the valve stays open, but the Takoon one, you have to jam the pins in, while you're squeezing the strut at the same time.

Anyway, very favourable first impressions, but I wouldn't switch from my kites - they boost higher, and go upwind slightly better, in my opinion, and the amount of sheeting and trimming is a pain.

The Crossbow
Today, it's been blowing North Westerly, so I shot down to Poole Harbour, dreading the carnage - it's a sunny day in August... where are these tnucs in February, huh?

Anyway, stood watching the carnage for ages, thinking "can I really be bothered to pump up my kite to then have some numpty wrap their lines around mine" whilst wincing at the collisions and watching with horror as kites tumbled towards the road.

Gary demo'ed the 9m Crossbow to me... all pretty much as expected. The stopper ball looked loads better. The pulley system and depower looked complicated but easy to use. All well designed stuff though - nice solid feel, unlike the Takoon, which has a slightly Heath-Robinson feel to the whole thing.

Faffed around for a bit, and came back when it was a bit quieter, and nabbed a go on the 12m Crossbow. The bar felt a lot more natural to me - more feedback, more pressure in the steering. Didn't really like the amount of force needed to sheet in though - I prefer kites that fly off the front lines - but after a couple of minutes, I didn't really notice it.

There wasn't really a great deal of difference in the way the Crossbow flew to be honest. Its turn speed is similar to that of the Nova, it was similarly sluggish through the window for a 12m. However, I felt the bar made an enormous difference.... it was really easy to maintain a constant pull, in exactly the same way that I would with my own kites. It felt very natural, and it was very easy to rip upwind.

Carving through the turns was similar - carry loads of speed, chuck the kite like your life depends on it, slice your way around.... loads of fun! Similar in every way, except it was easier to dump the power - with the Nova, you really had to stretch if you wanted to dump most of the power, but with this, you just sheeted out to the stopper ball, and that was enough.

Jumps were similar to the Nova - good, with great hangtime, but you really notice the difference that the sheeting is making, which was slightly disconcerting when I once sheeted out a bit too much to find I was dropping fast - it was OK though, just sheeted in again.

Again, kiteloops are a piece of p1ss, although I had a tendancy to over depower, which wasn't the case with the Nova, simply because it wasn't so easy to sheet out!

Then I had a go on the 9m. Now that kite is a lot of fun! Cabrinha, if you're listening, please make your 12m fly at the speed of your 9m - it whizzes around the window like a beauty, and is a bit easier going on your arms.

Tried some unhooked stuff with the 9m, and it's a joy - did the biggest railey of my life. It seems to get you blasting along a lot quicker than the 12, and then you can really load up, because it's not designed to sit so forward in the window like my Rhinos, and just let it rip.

The 9 clearly has a good windrange, as I was going upwind on it, when people were out on 13/14m kites. You've got to get moving fast, but it's really easy to work it. Another thing about the Crossbows is, I didn't touch the trim at all - I had all the sheeting range I needed.

Managed to spunk the 9 into the water at one point, and it went onto its back, and looked as if it was going to roll completely at one point, and then it went face-to-wind. I pulled on the front lines to get it to turn halfway around, as instructed, and then tried to pull on the back lines to get the wingtip to catch the wind, but the back lines wouldn't go under the kite, so they were pulling the kite the wrong way. Tried this for ages, and eventually had to get relaunched by another kiter. I wonder how many times a situation like that might arise.

Hopped back on the 12, which felt even slower than ever, and tried again to boost as high as I could. Lots of highish jumps, with loads of nice floaty hangtime. Not staggeringly good, but reasonably impressive. The float is nicely downwards, and not massively downwind too, which is great.

Then I tried to go blind in 3" of water, and busted my footstrap, so that was the end of my session. To be honest, I had to come in anyway, as my arms were completely knackered - it seems that the bar pressure was taking its toll after all, and I even had mild pain in my elbow (my LEFT elbow before anybody drops in any wnaking jokes).

Looking at the kite on the beach, it's definitely got a more solid build feel to the kite than the Nova had. There's some nice heavy weight dacron on the leading edge and struts that looks hard-wearing, and a few more scuff guards here and there. It's still a Cabrinha at the end of the day... so it's bound to be a bit more flimsey than a Slingshot/Naish/North etc.

So this kite impressed me still further with the whole concept, but it still had its downsides. I suppose I could develop triceps like Arnie and put up with arthritic elbows in my old age, but until the 12m flies as light at the bar as the 9m or the Nova, I'm slightly put off the Crossbow.

I'm also moved to concede that perhaps, maybe, just maybe, the Crossbow might go upwind a teeny weeny little bit better than my 2005 Rhinos. But would I swap my Rhinos for Crossbows? No way, my Rhinos have the precise bar feel I want, I can ride them all day, and they boost better than anything else around.


In Summary
Are they for beginners? I would have loved to learn on kites like these. The depower is every bit as good as it's cracked up to be.

Are they only for beginners? I really love the fact that an intermediate like me can throw the kite around as agressively as I see the pros doing on conventional kites, and this definitely offers a lot of potential. In fact, the best thing is that you need far less ability to pull off an imitiation of some moves that the super skilled guys are pulling.

Are they worth the money? Well, you could almost cover the windrange of two kites with one - don't believe anybody who tells you it'll cover three - but you're still going to need two of them to cover the same range as a three-kite quiver. I'm sure they're not worth it for advanced intermediates and above, but they could make kitesurfing a lot more enjoyable if you've been at the same level for ages, and you're struggling to find that extra confidence you need, or you're just rubbish in gusty conditions.

This is more of a significant event for the next generation of kitesurfers. Most of us are all well able to use edge control to depower, are able to move the kite with more or less agression, depending on the conditions etc. What this means for the next generation is far less death runs and spankings. They'll never develop the skills that most of us have got, but they're not necessary if these kites become the status quo.

For the rest of us, we split into two groups - the 'balls to the wall' types who are happy to crank their kite hard, and ride out the occasional spanking, and the 'happy to play it safe' types who've got kite and board control mastered, and are happily in the comfort zone, and won't go any further (or will just progress very slowly) because they don't like the heavy wipeouts.

For those who fall into the latter category, you might find these kites take your riding to the next level, but remember, when you start down that path, you leave behind all those hard-earned skills, and you'll be rubbish if you then try and get onto a high performance boost machine and do the same stuff.

Just my two cents
WIM

Geen avatar

Berichten: 385
Antwoord #20 Augustus 17, 2005, 10:55:58
edit2Rapporteer  
Nog een crossbow review.
http://www.ikiteboarding.com/article_detail.aspx?id=163
Marc de Munnik

Berichten: 1252
Antwoord #21 Augustus 17, 2005, 12:16:49
edit2Rapporteer  


Ach, het regent revieuws het beste is toch echt zelf testen!
big_ben_lair

Berichten: 795
Antwoord #22 Januari 07, 2007, 06:55:21
edit2Rapporteer  
Wij Nederlanders zullen toch niet zomaar in al die verhaaltjes trappen. Testen is inderdaad de beste optie. Cabrinha heeft ook een leuk value for money verhaaltje op de site. Klopt ook niet veel van. Zij gaan uit van een 2-kite-set tegen een 4-kite-set met als kleinste maat een 12. Ik ken niemand in NL met zo'n set 18,16,14,12. Ze lullen allemaal maar wat.

ik heb een 8, 10, 14 en 18 en daar kunnen geen 2 bows tegen aan!!!!
WIM

Geen avatar

Berichten: 385
Antwoord #23 Januari 07, 2007, 09:23:58
edit2Rapporteer  
Toch wel, makkelijke zelf.
Miss Terious
Gast
Antwoord #24 Maart 27, 2007, 05:05:04
edit2Rapporteer  
Thanks for these honest reviews. I am a beginner (waterstart) and just bought myself a Nova 12 2006 last week. After having done my first waves with a Rhino (not exactly for beginners - allright I know what you're thinking but I did not know any different); this Nova boosted my confidence this weekend. And what a difference. Certainly OK for a beginner like me I guess. This one will do for the time being! This super Nova wil get me to the stars!!
Miss Terious
« vorige volgende »
Ga naar:  


© 2002 - 2024 Kitehigh

Sorry, the copyright must be in the template.
Please notify this forum's administrator that this site is missing the copyright message for SMF so they can rectify the situation. Display of copyright is a legal requirement. For more information on this please visit the Simple Machines website.